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172: What’s Working On Facebook Messenger Right Now

Posted by Austin Brawner on November 13, 2018


What if you could make more money in a single day than your business previously made in its entire lifetime?

That’s what happened for Mark Arruda in August, typically his company’s slowest month.

Mark, owner and CEO of Constantly Varied Gear, joined us earlier this year to talk about how he uses Facebook Messenger in his business. Today, he’s back, and in the eight months since we last had Mark on the show he’s continued to ramp up his Messenger marketing and is seeing incredible results.

In this episode, Mark shares the Messenger strategy he used that fateful day in August, and the other tactics he’s using to grow his list and drive sales.


Episode Highlights

  • 7:13 The Facebook Messenger tactic Mark’s using to gain Messenger subscribers and how it connects with his on-site lead capture.
  • 9:56 When Mark got started with Messenger bots and how long it’s taken him to build his current system.
  • 11:09 How allowing customers to vote on products via Messenger has been incredibly successful for Mark.
  • 14:39 A good thing to do if you’re just starting out with Messenger.
  • 17:27 What is a Facebook Messenger sequence?
  • 22:04 How Mark maps out his Messenger marketing plan.
  • 23:48 The first thing you should do before getting started with Messenger marketing.
  • 26:08 The chatbot Mark is using to grow his list and stop potential customers from leaving his site. 
  • 28:45 Why Mark is shifting almost all of his prospecting efforts to Click-to-Messenger ads.
  • 31:22 Using Messenger across different business verticals.
  • 33:35 The best copy for Click-to-Messenger ads.
  • 36:18 The Messenger strategy that led Constantly Varied Gear to do more sales in a single day in August than during the entire lifetime of the company.
  • 39:25 The importance of reaching your customers through a variety of different platforms, and how Messenger can tie into all of them.

Links and Resources

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Andrew Foxwell: I know I met Mark and Ben, his colleague from Constantly Varied Gear in January and February, and just incredibly nice people. The thing I always love about Mark is he's really thoughtful and he's always finding another way to try to increase customer experience. And so today, that's really what he's talking about with Messenger and how he's built a Bot, how they built a Bot, how they use it in daily sequences, how they use it in customer loyalty. So this is a really meaty episode. So buckle your seatbelt.

Austin Brawner: Buckle your seatbelt. Mark, welcome to the show.

Mark Arruda: Hey guys, how's it going?

Andrew Foxwell: Well, I tell you, it's going really well. Anytime we have you on we're very excited. And you know, long time listener,second-time guest.

Mark Arruda: Second-time guest.

Andrew Foxwell: Second-time guest, Mark Arruda from How's business going? My friend.

Mark Arruda: It's busy. It's been good, we're getting into the busiest time of year now. So should be fun. Yeah.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah. It should be very fun. Well, we are excited to have you on because you have a new project you're working on with a few other friends, which we're going to get to the Messenger Mastermind Podcast, we're gonna talk about that. But you have been doing a lot with Chatbots and you have been really investing time and energy into just making that really effective as a channel and a sales channel for you. And Austin and I had just been chatting about it and we're like, “Man, we have got to get Mark back on to talk about this because it's something clearly people are integrating as much as they possibly can.”

So I guess just starting off, bots are something obviously we hear a lot about, and there's a lot … I personally get overwhelmed with the number of ways they can get used. So for you and looking at this, Mark, like what are the biggest opportunities right now with Chatbots for ecommerce? What are the things that everybody should have bot … like not only set up but dialed in?

Mark Arruda: You're exactly right. There are so many things. It's so versatile, so many different ways to go at it, but probably our favorite is to just simply use the Ref URL, which basically just means you can create a Bot and if you're using ManyChat, they are just gonna spit out a URL and anytime anyone clicks at URL it's going to open up the Bot that you created. So I mean, when I say that, that's wide open to a lot of different things, but if you spend some time thinking about it, you can use that link in a lot of different ways. Whether it's inserting it on a button on your website or inserting it into an email, or any other place. That's been the best way to really gain subscribers for us.

Andrew Foxwell: Is this kind of using it everywhere? Okay.

Mark Arruda: Yes.

Austin Brawner: Tell us a little bit more about how you're using that specifically? What's been the most effective tool wherever you put it on your website where you feel like it's been the most effective?

Mark Arruda: Yeah, probably the best way right now is we're actually a using it on the back end of our lead capture, which we use a spin to win, which I know Austin loves. But what we actually did was instead of giving the discount code immediately after the spin to win, we added it as a button, the Ref URL. So we have them spin, they win a discount code, and we say in order to claim the discount code, they have to click the button, and when they click that button, it automatically opens up a Messenger Bot, and that Messenger Bot will give them the discount code that they want and it will also offer them three additional buttons to choose from.

And we continue with the gamification and we say, “ You can win a bigger discount, just choose the door. Door one, door two, door three, those are the buttons.” And as soon as they click a button, they become a Messenger subscriber and we also give them a slightly bigger discount, which obviously will help with sales because now people feel like not only did they win the first discount, but now they even have a better discount, so they better use it immediately. But we've been seeing some really good things with gaining Messenger subscribers that way. We're more gaining somewhere around 200 new subscribers every day.

Andrew Foxwell: I mean, you really got a big system, I feel like dialed in of really what you're doing at Constantly Varied Gear. How long has it taken to get to this point? I mean, you've tested so many different things and what are the … Can you walk us through the timeline of a high level timeline of when you started things and how long taken to get to the point where you have this system dialed in? Because the reason I'm asking a question is I have been asked specifically how long does it take to build up a program. Right? And I know that Austin gets asked that a lot, of how long does it take to get an email program going, and it's something that you're constantly working on. So walk us through some of the failures too, if you would.

Mark Arruda: Sure. I can tell you exactly when we started it because I actually remember it was at Austin's Email Intensive that it came up, people talking about Messenger Marketing and ManyChat. And at that time we had ManyChat installed but we hadn't actually done anything with it. It had the thought process of like there's way too much going on in the business right now and this is like a really scary tool. It's so robust. But shortly after that trip, I came back from that conference and sat down, and just started learning and testing different things.

So it's been a little over a year since we started with it, which may seem like a long time if you haven't started yet, but it is something that can happen really quickly if you have other lists, for instance, email lists or if you spend a decent amount on Facebook ads or Facebook groups, any way that you have a community or a list of any sort.

A really good idea is to try to move people from those areas onto your Messenger list. So instead of just saying like, “Okay, we have nothing here, it's not worth our time.” Instead just do some things like maybe give us some discount codes through your email, but make it so that they have to click a Ref URL to open up a Bot and get that discount code. as soon as they interact with that Bot, they're now your Messenger subscriber.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah. Right. So you … I mean, this was a couple years ago that you've done this. But what are some of the other things that you do? I mean, I know a lot of what you do is growth tools, which we're going to talk about, and utilizing that. But generally at a high level, what has worked better for you than worse as it relates to some of the experiences you've had?

Mark Arruda: Sure. Early on now, like I said, this goes back to about a year, we had a lot of really good success with the Facebook comment growth tool and I'm only touching upon that because that was a really big success and trying to use that more now. We've been seeing it being a lot more glitchy. I'm not sure if it's on ManyChat ends or Facebook ends, I would probably guess Facebook.

But that tool has been a little bit tough to use for us but things that have been working well once we gain a subscriber is just simply broadcasting, promotions, product releases, even polling your audience, whether that be to ask them what type of products they'd like to see in the future.

That ends up being extremely, extremely powerful because once they placed that vote, ManyChat allows you to tag based on different interactions. So if we give a couple of options and say like, “Hey, we're thinking about making this product and this product,” and based on what someone will click as their vote, we're tagging them accordingly. So then when we actually make that product, we can follow back up with them because we know that they voted for it. And that's been something that's really great for us.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah. That's one thing that I don't want to gloss over in this episode, which is the voting component of what you do, of actually putting your ... Once people become part of the experience and they've subscribed, taking that information and then giving to them options, “Hey, what do you think of this or this?”

When I subscribed in February when we met, I love voting on products and I am not a woman. But I think it's interesting to continue the experience of voting because it's like, “Oh, that's a pretty cool product or that's a cool product,” and it's very participatory in its approach. So I think that's something that's really worth pointing out that a lot of people could definitely try.

Mark Arruda: Yeah. So we can talk about that a little bit more real quick. Just we're always in really good communications with our audience and we do a lot with email, we do a lot with our Facebook group and we pull them or we did in the past. But the difficult thing is with email is getting them to reply to an email isn't always the best thing. And we can survey them, and that works well, and we can ask our Facebook group, and they're extremely engaged. So that works well too.

But where it really stands out with Messenger is the fact that we can actually tag based on their vote, instantly follow back up with them. And it's so easy for them to just press a button. They're not having to reply to an email, they're not having to make a comment in a Facebook group. They're just clicking a button.

Andrew Foxwell: Exactly.

Austin Brawner: For some context, Mark, one of the things that I always hear is questions around like volume, sending volume from Messenger versus email. After your year of experience here, what type of a balance have you struck around volume that you are sending through Messenger, whether that's polls, promotions? Do you have a breakdown? What works for you?

Mark Arruda: Yeah, we try to send about once a week. Now, when I say that, we do have a lot in place, so I don't necessarily recommend for everyone to just go out there and start messaging their audience once a week. We segment our lists a lot, so not everyone is receiving that one a week message. We do share a lot of our content marketing through Facebook, through Messenger, so we will … A good thing that someone could do if you're just starting out, if you have a list of however many people, you can send out a broadcast to that list and you can ask them if they want to receive whatever specific content you're trying to put out on that day.

And if they say yes, then you tag them and in the future when you have more content, you know to send to those people. If those people say no, then those people don't want your content, so they're not gonna receive that message every week.

So those other people that aren't going to receive that, you can instead be following up with them maybe once or twice a month just sending promotions or discounts. If you are going to send promotions and discounts, you don't want to open with the promotion or discount in the original message. That's where something like polling works really well because Facebook does not want you to be blasting their users with constant discounts and things that are bothersome to people.

So a really good way to get around that is to ask them a question that they might actually engage with, something that they would benefit from. And once they interact, you say, “Thank you so much for your vote on this or I hope you really get a lot of value out of this content. As a thank you for that, we're going to give you this discount code,” and it comes in the back end.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah. This is basically what you're talking about, sending that once a week in the volume. You put out what you call a Messenger motivation, right? Is your sequence right there. So, that particular sequence has, I think the last you publicly talked about it, 4,500 people subscribed. It's got a 98% open rate, which is insane to me. For those that don't understand, there's a lot of steps to this, right? It's like you get it set up, you start to understand the way you want to message it, thinking about volume and when.

First of all, what is a sequence and what do people like and don't like within that sequence? Is a sequence something that you then send to those tagged people?

Mark Arruda: Yeah. I can touch on all that for you. So just on your first number there, 4,500 people through that sequence, that number was just from a few weeks ago and since then we have really doubled down hard on our Messenger motivation, and we're actually up to 6,500 people. So we're cruising on that now because we've found a lot of value in it.

So I guess first and foremost, what a sequence is, is I guess you could think of it as like a flow for an email. You create a sequence where a day one gets this message, day five gets this message, something like that. And when someone is subscribed to a sequence, they will receive the same flow as every other person that went through that sequence.

And what we do for Messenger motivation is actually a daily sequence, which is a difficult thing to pull off because it is a message that's showing up on someone's phone or desktop every day, so that needs to be something that somebody really wants to receive. And what Messenger motivation for us is because we are a fitness apparel company, we're sharing a motivational quote and we also include a little GIF in there have someone, one of our top personalities that is wearing our clothes in the GIF, just a two second GIF or something like that just as a soft sell.

And every day they just receive that quote and people love it. People that don't have it, that have heard about it say like, “How do I get started with this?” And every single day they just received those things. They see like about a 99% open rate. So as long as someone is receiving the sequence, which at this point is over one year long, we've built out a message every day for over a year with 99% open rates.

Austin Brawner: That's incredible. That's incredible. But how does this differ from what you're doing on the backend of capturing emails from the spin to win tool you're using.

Mark Arruda: Perfect question because we tie it in directly with that. We do actually tie it in in a lot of our different growth tools, but it's the perfect example. So spin to win ties to our follow-up message once they become a Messenger subscriber, they are automatically set up to receive the Messenger motivation sequence. So they are not automatically opted-in. They have to agree to opt-in, of course. But what will happen is once they have gone through our spin to win into our Messenger, 23 hours later, they receive a message from us that asks them if they would like to join our daily Messenger motivation and it gives them the option.

Austin Brawner: Very cool. So that's the opt-in. That's where you're getting this tremendous volume. Do you know what percentage of your people actually click and join that?

Mark Arruda: Yes. So I believe about 50% of people say that they would like to join Messenger motivation.

Austin Brawner: Wow, and then they go.

Mark Arruda: We see that they stick around for about 75% of people are still there after 50 days.

Andrew Foxwell: Wow. I think one thing in going through this and mapping out this episode, even for me, it's overwhelming. I think to some degree it's like there's a lot here as we talked about before. There's so many different things you can do and you talked about one of the main things doing, using that Ref URL, how do you plan this out? Do you sit down and just write it down on a piece of paper of what you're looking to do or where do you go about it?

Because I think a lot of people, they have started on this or maybe they haven't started but they want to, or maybe they've done a cart abandonment thing and that's it. But clearly what you're doing is building a brand. So how do you start to actually map these things out? Like yeah, is it written down? Do you visually do it or is it just how do you translate that? Because I feel like that's a really big differentiator of what you're doing.

Mark Arruda: Yeah. I mean you're asking a scary question asking to go inside my thought process on a lot of these things, because I am certainly all over the place. Now, a lot of times it's just the things that I often think about is that Messenger can be used in almost every single part of your business.

If you're doing something with email or a Facebook ad or anything else, it can be done also with Messenger, or tied to Messenger. And it just comes down to, like putting it at the top of your priority list sometimes, like things like that gets pushed aside, because there's a lot of important things in your day.

But if you don't actually sit down and build these things out, you're never going to see the results from them. And the really good thing about Messenger is that it's very instant. So, you can build something pretty quickly and give it a test and you can know if it's working well or not. In learning ManyChat can be a little bit difficult, but just like anything else, once you learn it, it's 10 times easier.

Austin Brawner: It's true, with most everything, you gotta sit down and make it happen and get it done. If you were to give advice, if someone was to come to you and say, “ All right, Mark. I'm ready to sit down and get it done. What should I get done first?” After this year of experience knowing what works for you, what advice would you give someone to start on first?

Mark Arruda: Yeah. First and foremost, you should look at it like this. You need to work on your goal tools in order to build that list before even thinking about how are you going to broadcast to that list, because setting up spending time on a broadcast or, or a sale or something like that is a waste of your time, if you don't actually have anyone to send that broadcast to. So, you just need to think about different ways that you can bring people into your Messenger list and that's going to depend a lot on how your business does certain things.

If you have a large Facebook ad budget, I would absolutely recommend to a run a lot of Facebook click-to-Messenger ads. That's been a great way for us to gain a lot of subscribers, we're actually even seeing really good numbers from Facebook ads compared to Facebook ads that opened with Messenger versus not. If you're not so much spending with Facebook ads, then if you have an email list, then start tying REF URLs into your email list. If you don't have a big email list, but you're collecting them, then you should be tying in, Messenger growth tools into your lead capture.

If you're starting off, just be thinking about how you can, how you can push people through a Messenger Bot, because as soon as they interact with that you will be able to then follow back up with them later.

Andrew Foxwell: So, let me ask about that specifically, because I think, we have jumped around a lot in this episode, which is good, a lot of different ideas, but what, what are the options with growth tools? One of them is Comment to Grow. Then there's the click from a Facebook ad that you set up, so … a common one, I've seen on something like this is you launch a Facebook ad to your VIP list, or to your previous customers or to let's say your top 25% website customer audience, and you get them to subscribe to like a VIP list, that then you broadcast to around sales.

Mark Arruda: About that. I'm gonna use that.

Andrew Foxwell: Well, I mean it's a combination of ideas I learned from you and some other places, but like what is your … what are the other growth tool options, and what are the ones that you've seen be the most effective?

Mark Arruda: Yeah. One cool thing that we're doing and it might not apply to everyone. Although, if you think about it, you might be able to tie it in somehow, but we're using the Messenger Ref URL, we created a sizing Chatbot. So, because we sell apparel, probably one of our customer's biggest pain points is sizing and a lot of people will bounce from the site because they're just not sure about sizing. They don't want to shop online for clothes, they're worried about having to return or exchange. That's extremely common.

So, what we built was a leggings sizing Chatbot, and what that does is that asks a series of questions, height, weight, body type, things like that. And based on how people answer those questions, we spit out a few pictures that have been submitted by our audience, and says like, “Based on the questions that you've answered, people most similar to you where this size.”

So first and foremost, our audience loves that. It's, it saves our support a lot of time. And obviously most importantly, it's giving reason for people to join our Messenger subscriber list by interacting with that Bot.

That's Messenger ... That's one another way that we use Messenger Ref URL, click-to-Messenger ads through Facebook. You can use the JSON ManyChat growth tool, Facebook comments growth tool is another one and all that that is, if you make a post to your fan page, you can sync it up with the Facebook comments growth tool and ManyChat. And when someone comments on your Facebook post, it will automatically trigger a bot to message them. That one's pretty cool.

There's a lot of different ways. I mean, you could do something as simple as just a pop up on your site, that's similar to a lead capture except it's a Messenger checkbox.

Andrew Foxwell: When you do the chat growth tool … I know you've done a lot of different things with obviously with the comment one, you'd be launching those ads for page post engagement objective, likely. And in another case, you'd be launching them for click-to-Messenger. I know that a lot of your ads, as you said, that you're actually seeing them be profitable, on prospecting in some cases, or at least recovering their costs. Which one is more lucrative for you? Is it the click-to-message growth tool or is it the comment growth tool?

Mark Arruda: If you can get the comment growth tool to work, then that is probably going to be a better play, just because it allows you to grow engagement on the post. With that being said, we're actually all in on the click-to-Messenger, just because of how buggy we have found the Facebook comment tool to be. We've set up several different times a Facebook comment tools and they just, sometimes they just won't work.

So, rather than wasting time and effort on that, we've gone all in on the click to Messenger. And exactly like you said, from our prospecting standpoint, we're pretty much shifting almost all of our prospecting onto click to Messenger ads.

Andrew Foxwell: Oh Wow. Okay. That's pretty big news.

Mark Arruda: Yeah, we're seeing CPA's, almost half for Messenger compared to non.

Austin Brawner: Wow. That's really, that's fascinating and exciting. So, one of the things from the outside looking in … you've got a lot of stuff going on a lot ... you've got Chatbots here, Chatbots there, you've got emails going out. How as a team do you keep this organized? What is, what is the team behind this look like? And how has that evolved since you started to where you're at now, about a year later from kicking off Messenger?

Mark Arruda: Yeah. Well, when we first started it was, it was probably like most other people, it was on the back burner. Maybe it was a shiny new tool that was on the list but never really touched. And since then it's just become more and more at the top of the list. It's always been me on working with these things, but since then we've brought in one of our employees, Ben, who you'll hear about is also a host on our podcasts. And Ben has absolutely been crushing it for us. He's allowed me to kinda like just throw things at him. “Hey, how about this idea,” and he can just whip it up for us really quick.

So, we now have two people, myself and Ben fully on this because with pretty much every aspect of the business, we look at it and say, "How can we tie Messenger into this?" Because a Messenger subscriber for us is quickly moving up on the list as potentially bigger than an email subscriber.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah, I think that's, it's awesome. It's huge that you've seen it like that. One thing I've wondered too, in going through this, Mark, you know, we, we've talked about utilizing different growth tools. We've talked about the way that you build sequences and how you start to prioritize this. How do you think the business vertical affects performance? Because I know you talked to a lot of people through your Facebook group and through other marketers, etc., especially through your Messenger Mastermind Podcast that you're doing now.

Do you think that this applies so well to you because your customers are primarily young females? If I'm trying to get leads on a house or financial advisor, I don't know, something else totally random. Do you think this would still work as well? Or do you now think that's okay?

Mark Arruda: That's a great question. Obviously, I can't speak personally as running that myself as Constantly Varied Gear is mainly targeted towards women between the ages of 20 to 50 maybe. But we do talk to a lot of people in different verticals that are seeing success. I do think our audience is probably a little bit more interactive than most, but I think that's probably the case on any platform usually see that women have a little bit more of an edge with being engaged almost everywhere.

With that being said, I can just speak for myself as a 33-year-old male, that when I see an ad and it's a click-to-Messenger, rather than looking at that ad and saying, “Hey, I have some questions about it, but I just … it's going to take too much work to figure it out." So, I'm just going to scroll right past that ad. When I see that click to Messenger, I'm much more likely to just click it and ask that question. And if there's a quick answer for me, then it's going to increase the chances that whatever it is at that person running that out is trying to accomplish, that I may reach that objective.

Austin Brawner: What type of copy and questions do you ask in your click-to-Messenger ads?

Mark Arruda: Yeah. That can vary a lot, but a lot of times it's pretty similar to what some of our other ads might look like. We of course want to try to always be asking a question, especially with something like a click-to-Messenger, just because that's just the best way to be engaged with people and that's the whole thing that Messenger is doing. It's not just like here's an advertisement that we're going to slap in front of you. It's more about talking with them and speaking with them about maybe a certain pinpoint. So, usually a question that will resonate with your audience is a great way to get into a good Messenger conversation.

Andrew Foxwell: You recently, Mark, had that one of your best sales days you've ever had, right?

Mark Arruda: We did.

Andrew Foxwell: Can you … I knew, a lot of it was credit to Messenger.

Austin Brawner: It was in August, right?

Andrew Foxwell: Tell us ... Yeah it was in August, I think. Was it or was it in September?

Mark Arruda: That is … we actually. So, the thing that you're referring to in August at that time was our biggest day. Since then we have actually done another Messenger release in September that had top that. But yeah, the one that you are referring to, our slowest month of the year is August, as I'm sure it is for most ecommerce companies, and at that time, two months ago, we did have our highest sales day of the year, or I should say, not just of the year, of the entire length of this company in August, because of Messenger.

Austin Brawner: Incredible. This is one, just to even frame it even more. It's not like you guys are running … I mean, you're running a fitness apparel company. And fitness in general, January is usually the month when it's the hottest, right. So, it's even more skewed towards the beginning of the year versus other companies?

Mark Arruda: Oh yeah, by far. January is our best. November is obviously great, because of shoppers are warm and Black Friday, Cyber Monday. The summer is the slowest, August is the worst, but we were able to carve that this year.

Andrew Foxwell: So, what were the main cores of this strategy that you're willing to share?

Mark Arruda: I have no problem laying it out there, because I think that everybody should be doing this, and it's not going to take anything away from us. So, we have a whole system from start to finish where … and I kind of touched upon it throughout this episode, but once we have that broadcast list, we send out our broadcast with some potential new products and product releases have become gigantic for us, just because of the very engaged audience and followers that we've built up over the last five years.

So, what we do is … we have a few new products and we show them to them through Messenger. They haven't seen these anywhere else, it's going to be the first time that they've seen them and we just asked them for their opinion. We say, which one would you like to see? And as I alluded to earlier in the episode, we tag them based on how they vote. And based on how they vote actually does determine whether or not we make a product.

We have done this now I think on five different occasions. Some occasions we've, we've put out some votes and we didn't like the numbers, so we didn't make any either of the products. Other times we've seen great numbers for both, so we've made both the products, and once those products are made, we use Messenger to follow back up with them before the product has been released, just to kind of build more hype, remind them of the product.

We will usually do something like maybe ask them to name the product, that usually gets them pretty engaged and make them feel involved. And then once the product's ready to be released, we messaged them and we say, “It's here.”

And on our last release, the first notice of this product is live. Actually, we went through Messenger and Messenger is extremely, extremely fast. We sold more in three hours than we did on any other day of the entire life of this company, because of how instant Messenger is.

Austin Brawner: That's incredible.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah, it is. It's what you're doing all year, right? I mean, you're just … you're putting together, you're warming them up all the time of getting them involved and you're playing the long game. Which I think is a very big important part of this. And I think that it lives alongside email really well. I think it clearly integrates with Facebook really well. I think it clearly integrates with organic content on Instagram and Facebook as well. So, you can utilize those in the flows and get people's take and you can utilize those in the Messenger motivation daily sequence and things like that.

And then when time comes to make a sale, guess what? They're ready because they've been excited about that release. They were part of that release, which I think is a really, really core part of your strategy.

Mark Arruda: Yeah. I don't wanna lead anybody astray on Messenger. You're not just going to fire up Messenger and all of a sudden like see groundbreaking days. It's a lot of work and it's not just Messenger, this is our audience, this is our following. We build them and engage with them on a lot of different platforms, and the success of our business is absolutely because we diversify into a lot of platforms. But what we're noticing is that Messenger is a great way to tie a lot of those platforms together and communicate with our audience that we develop in other areas of our business.

Austin Brawner: Mark, this has been really, really, really helpful and also one of the more detailed breakdowns of what people are actually doing, the case studies of what's happening on ManyChat. So, you recently started the Messenger Mastermind Podcast. Why don't you tell us a little bit about why you started that and what it looks like?

Mark Arruda: Yeah. I started with Messenger marketing just like anybody else might do it and just kind of tuning into the podcast that I love and the blogs that I follow and just looking for this information on how people are doing certain things, and there's not a lot out there. A lot of the Messenger marketing that you see out there is really tailored towards agencies and local businesses, which is great but didn't really so much apply to my ecommerce business.

So, I sat down with Jeremy Horowitz, which was a previous guest on your podcast. He's actually a person that I met back at your Intensive for email marketing last August. We've been in contact for a while, we share a lot of information about our companies. He does a lot with, and partnered up with him and an employee with Constantly Varied Gear, a good friend of mine, Ben Vandal. And we started this podcast because, as I've shared throughout this episode, we do a lot of stuff and we rely on it a lot, and we're moving more towards a more focused towards Messenger.

So we're just wanted to share the things that we do every day and a lot of the things that we talked about here today, like you said, we said a lot and we covered a lot. So in our podcast, we take kind of break those down into individual topics and go a little bit deeper and hopefully, explain them a little bit better since it doesn't have to be, kind of just glossed over quickly.

Austin Brawner: Sure, sure.

Andrew Foxwell: Yeah, right. Going more in depth.

Austin Brawner: Mark, it has been awesome. We're going to put a link in the show notes to the podcast. Also they can word search iTunes?

Mark Arruda: They can search iTunes, Stitcher, anywhere they can listen to your podcast.

Just one fun fact I wanted to throw out there is that, Andrew, is actually the person that came up with the name for our podcast. I love to give credit and let everyone know that he had his involvement in there.

Andrew Foxwell: Oh yeah man. Yeah, I love doing that. Gracie and I love naming things. I'm glad I was able to help, man.

Austin Brawner: Hey, this has been awesome, Mark. Really appreciate it. Thanks for coming back on, and yeah, go and download his podcast and start listening, because it'll help you drive some of those Messengers sales.

Mark Arruda: Thanks so much guys.

Andrew Foxwell: I know I met Mark and Ben, his colleague from Constantly Varied Gear in January and February, and just incredibly nice people. The thing I always love about Mark is he's really thoughtful and he's always finding another way to try to increase customer experience. And so today, that's r...

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